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User Info Your Daily Greek Update. SAVED or not SAVED? in forum [Breaking]
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Took them long enough to deny the Der Spiegel article.

Quote:

http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_art....
Monday Jul 23, 2012 (18:22)

The International Monetary Fund on Monday dismissed a weekend news report that it may refuse to continue supporting Greece as it prepares for talks with the new Greek government on its international bailout.

The German weekly Der Spiegel reported at the weekend that Greece would need up to 50 billion euros in additional aid beyond the 130 billion euros already agreed and the IMF may refuse to contribute further funding.

"The IMF is supporting Greece in overcoming its economic difficulties,» an IMF spokesperson said in response to the Der Spiegel report.

"An IMF mission will start discussions with the country's authorities on July 24 on how to bring Greece's economic program, which is supported by IMF financial assistance, back on track."

The IMF is part of a «troika» of international lenders, including the European Commission and European Central Bank, which will meet with the new Greek government of Prime Minister Antonis Samaras to review a 130 billion euro rescue program pushed off track by elections.

Samaras has vowed to renegotiate the bailout while staying in the euro zone.

The IMF has signaled it is open to discussing new targets under the economic program but may be willing to review new timelines given delays caused by political developments in Greece.
Eo
Posts: 209
Incept: 2009-01-07

France
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So basically the biggest german newspaper is lying is such a matter?

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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
Albert Einstein
Lemonaid
Posts: 9881
Incept: 2008-01-20
Green
Metro Detroit
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...so basicly the IMF is stating they'll fork over the dough no matter what Greece does.

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"There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved." Ludwig von Mises
Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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The IMF watched Spain and Italy today and decided it was time to say something that sounds good

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry
Genesis
Posts: 130798
Incept: 2007-06-26
Admin A True American Patriot!
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The IMF examined the box sitting on the conference room table, decided to listen closely, and heard "tick...... tick..... tick....." smiley

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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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Actually the IMF said this
Quote:
The IMF is supporting Greece in overcoming its economic difficulties. An IMF mission will start discussions with the country’s authorities on July 24 on how to bring Greece’s economic program, which is supported by IMF financial assistance, back on track

No mention of new financial support specifically

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry

Genesis
Posts: 130798
Incept: 2007-06-26
Admin A True American Patriot!
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And now we know why the /ES futures recovered their earlier losses.

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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
Mayorquimby
Posts: 13909
Incept: 2008-09-18
Green
The Archaic Past
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They are going to drag this **** out beyond your worst nightmares. All of it.

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They who wish to hurt you, work within the law.
- Morrissey

Gold is theft.
Sean
Posts: 1766
Incept: 2009-04-21


Online
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Mayor is exactly right!

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* I think Ann Barnhardt is more and more right. God help us!
* Progressives / Marxists / Communists are many things, STUPID and IMPATIENT are not two of them.
* A hot civil war is coming.
* And people wonder why I prep!
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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citing anonymous sources
Quote:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/2....
Tue Jul 24, 2012

Greece is unlikely to be able to pay what it owes and further debt restructuring is likely to be necessary, three EU officials said on Tuesday, a cost that would have to fall on the European Central Bank and euro zone governments...


Quote:
"Greece is hugely off track," one of the officials told Reuters, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue. "The debt-sustainability analysis will be pretty terrible."


Quote:
Even though no formal discussions have begun over so-called official-sector involvement, two possibilities have been mentioned -- the ECB taking a writedown on the estimated 40 billion euros of Greek bonds it holds, or member states improving the terms on their loans to Athens.

But the officials Reuters spoke to listed six member states who are firmly opposed to extending Greece further lifelines, not only because of Athens's persistent missing of targets but because the costs will soon be born directly by taxpayers.

"The political dynamics are really going against the economic dynamics," one source said. "The economic arguments may be clear - we need to restructure Greece's debt if it is to be sustainable - but politically there's no willingness."
Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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Quote:
"The debt-sustainability analysis will be pretty terrible."

LOL! It was terrible *last* year!

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry
Lemonaid
Posts: 9881
Incept: 2008-01-20
Green
Metro Detroit
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As soon as Greece defaults they will get all the credit they need.

Debt to GDP will be hella good for awhile.

Get in on that ponzi and ride it again before it de-rails (and it will take a bit of time to de-rail... see "Argentina").

Money has to go somewhere after all.

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"There is no means of avoiding the final collapse of a boom brought about by credit expansion. The alternative is only whether the crisis should come sooner as the result of a voluntary abandonment of further credit expansion, or later as a final and total catastrophe of the currency system involved." Ludwig von Mises
Rd
Posts: 478
Incept: 2008-02-27
Gold
Long Island, NY
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I have read that once they default Greece will be eligible for loans from the IMF under developing nations program, probably already in the works.
Drench
Posts: 28631
Incept: 2009-11-10
Green
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Quote:
Citigroup Inc. (C) raised its estimate of the chances Greece will drop the euro in the next 12 to 18 months to about 90 percent, with prolonged economic weakness and spillover for the euro area.

In an analyst note, Citigroup updated its forecast for a Greek exit from the 17-nation currency union from a previous estimate of 50 percent to 75 percent, and said it would most likely happen in the next two to three quarters. Specifically, the bank assumes a Greece exit would occur on Jan. 1, 2013, while saying that is not a forecast of a precise date.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-25....
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/2....
Sun Jul 29, 2012

Political leaders in Greece have agreed on most of the austerity measures demanded by its creditors and are now eyeing pension and wage cuts to find the final 1.5 billion euros of savings still needed, a source close to the talks said on Sunday...


Quote:
But the lenders have so far appeared far from convinced, and officials have told Reuters the country is likely to require a new debt restructuring that the euro zone - faced with market turmoil in Italy and Spain as well - can ill afford.

Greek media have reported that the country's leaders are discussing possible layoffs of contractors in the public sector, a cap on pensions, cuts in welfare benefits, reductions in tax exemptions, and lower salaries for public employees as well as raising the retirement age by a year to make up for the shortfall in savings.


Quote:
With a decision on a new tranche of aid to Greece not expected until September, the country's already dire financial position appears to be getting increasingly precarious.

"The fact that we have not received the agreed aid installments has put pressure on our cash reserves. Until then, we are taking extra care in managing our cash," Deputy Finance Minister Christos Staikouras told Real News weekly...
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:

Piraeus Bank halts sale of Egyptian operation
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_art....
Tuesday Jul 31, 2012

Piraeus Bank SA, a Greek lender, said it is terminating with immediate effect the sale process of its unit, Piraeus BankEgypt.

Piraeus said it doesn’t intend to solicit any purchase offers in the near future for the unit and will focus on providing full support to its Egyptian banking operations, according to an Athens bourse filing on Tuesday. [Bloomberg]
Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/debt-....
Quote:
09.55 Greece's coalition government avoided the tricky subject of budget cuts at a meeting yesterday and discussed longer-term strategy measures instead, according to Democratic Left leader Fotis Kouvelis.

The government is yet to finalise a €11.5bn package of cuts that must be agreed in order to unlock its next bail-out tranche.

09.42 Evangelos Venizelos, leader of Greece's PASOK party, has admitted that the country's bail-out programme is off track and urged parliament to seek talks with ECB and EU officials.

He also reiterated calls for a two-year extension, until 2016, to implement Greece's savage budget cuts. He told parliament:

Quote:
No other country suffering such a recessionary shock has achieved so much on the fiscal adjustment front

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry
Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/debt-....
Quote:
08.26 Yesterday, US President Barack Obama reiterated his call for Europe to take "descisive steps" to tackle the debt crisis. He said:
Quote:
I don't think ultimately that the Europeans will let the euro unravel but they are going to have to take some decisive steps.

I am spending an enormous amount of time trying to work with them, and Tim Geithner is trying to work with them.

I feel better knowing that O is spending an enormous amount of time on this

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry

Rvacha
Posts: 8300
Incept: 2008-10-03
Gold
Cleveland
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http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_art....
Quote:
Greece’s coalition leaders are due to meet for the second time in three days Wednesday in a bid to agree on the details of 11.5 billion euros in cuts, which appear to have created the first fissures in the three-party alliance.

Prime Minister Antonis Samaras, who met with troika officials Tuesday, will host PASOK’s Evangelos Venizelos and Democratic Left’s Fotis Kouvelis in the hope of overcoming the reservations that his two coalition partners have about the savings being demanded by Greece’s lenders.

Sources said that Samaras assured troika inspectors that the cuts would be agreed this week and set out in detail by next week. The premier sees this as a vital part in securing a review from the troika that will be favorable enough to ensure the release of further loans from the eurozone and the International Monetary Fund.

Venizelos and Kouvelis, however, have growing reservations about agreeing to cuts to salaries and pensions. They argue that this would exacerbate Greece’s recession and threaten the government’s viability as there would be a backlash against the measures.

Venizelos also met with the officials from the IMF, European Commission and European Central Bank Tuesday. He put forward his plan for only 6.5 billion euros of cuts to be agreed now and then implemented over the next two years. The PASOK leader suggests that the remaining savings could be made during 2015 and 2016, provided the troika agrees to extend Greece’s fiscal adjustment period for two years.

<snip>

However, Venizelos is facing opposition from within his own party. Former ministers Michalis Chrysochoidis, Andreas Loverdos and Yiannis Ragousis voiced opposition to their leader’s stance on the cuts and the amendments to a university reform law. Chrysochoidis accused Venizelos of playing “public relations games” with the cuts.

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"I suggest you panic." - Hugh Hendry
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:
Leaked emails on Greek tax evasion embarrass government
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/08/01....

ATHENS, Aug 1 (Reuters) - A leaked document from Greek officials complaining they could not justify ambitious targets for proceeds from fighting tax evasion has embarrassed Greece's new government and led to the arrest of a senior finance official.

Lambros Liosis, budget department chief at the ministry's General Accounting Office, appeared before prosecutors on Wednesday after being charged with violating personal data and state secrecy laws for leaking the document....


Quote:
A photo of the document, which includes a chain of emails dated July 24 and 25 on the country's struggle to raise money from fighting tax evasion, was published on a Greek blog site.

It includes an email from one finance ministry official saying revenues from battling evasion would be 800 million euros less in 2013 than projected in a mid-term plan.

Another official from the fiscal data department complains that a target of raising 3.8 billion euros from the plan over 2013-2016 could not be justified, given a lack of numbers recorded in 2011 and no forecasts available for 2014-2016.

Patchy tax collection has long been a major problem in Greece, which is trying to show the so-called troika of EU and IMF lenders that it is on the path to reforming itself and deserves more aid to avoid bankruptcy.

"With this data, the General Accounting Office cannot argue during the technical meeting with the Troika on Thursday that we must include, even just symbolically, an amount for 2013 (i.e. 300 million)," the finance ministry official writes in the email to Greece's general secretary of fiscal policy, in which Liosis and other officials are copied.

"Without further documentation, it will also be difficult to convince them on a political level to accept a serious amount and the gap for 2013 widens by 924 million (and for 2014, by 651 million)."

The official then suggests the GAO "have a line" on tax evasion based on benchmarks like the number of new inspectors hired or audits made, or come along to the meeting with the lenders.

"Otherwise we will just have to accept their numbers," he concludes...

Krs
Posts: 688
Incept: 2009-05-07
Silver
Colleyville, Texas
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Vive La Interwebs

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Fog, smoke, and mirrors... perhaps those tin-foil-hat wearing digital dickweeds were on to something?
Tyler Durden on the Fed – Feb 28, 2013
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Greece population down by nearly 3 pct since 2001
http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_art....
Wednesday August 1, 2012
Degaston
Posts: 2264
Incept: 2007-07-27
Green
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Currently in 2012 they say "the remaining savings could be made during 2015 and 2016, provided the troika agrees to extend Greece’s fiscal adjustment period for two years".

In 2014 you can change this to say "the remaining savings could be made during 2017 and 2018, provided the troika agrees to extend Greece’s fiscal adjustment period for two years".


In 2016 you can change this to say "the remaining savings could be made during 2019 and 2020, provided the troika agrees to extend Greece’s fiscal adjustment period for two years".

Kick the can?

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3/17/2013: Bullish on nothing - 100 percent in cash.
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:

http://www.ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_art....
Friday August 3, 2012

A home-made explosive device detonated outside a branch of National Bank in the Athens neighborhood of Nea Smyrni early on Friday, damaging an ATM bank machine and three parked cars but causing no injuries.

There had been no claim of responsibility for the explosion by Friday evening though the act is typical of protests by anarchists and members of anti-establishment organizations.
Pietertvl
Posts: 3596
Incept: 2007-12-05

NFA
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Circle jerks continue ...

"The European Central Bank (ECB) has saved Greece from bankruptcy for the time being by securing it interim financing in the form of additional emergency loans from the Bank of Greece ..."

http://news.yahoo.com/ecb-saves-greece-b....

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"All the perplexities, confusion and distresses in America arise not from defects in the constitution or confederation, nor from want of honor or virtue, as much from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit, and circulation." ~ John Adams
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