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User Info Your Daily Spain Update. SAVED or not SAVED? in forum [Breaking]
Highrev
Posts: 5025
Incept: 2009-02-21
Silver
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Nice article Crossthread. Very good human interest stories. Not exactly objective treatment of the current economic situation, but that goes without saying as we are all well aware of the press's need to sell.

Here's something I wrote a while back about the lack of objectivity in modern journalism.
Quote:
Using this article, let me give an example of what I mean by infantile, funny page reporting ( http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/05/2.... ).

Conditional Tense ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conditional.... )

Headline Paragraph turns on the word "if" (sometimes called the biggest little word in the world).

Second paragraph turns on the conditional "should result".

3rd: factual statement

4th: "if" and "could"

5th: first statement factual, second sentence "if" again.

How's that for a start? What's it called in writers' terminology? A hook? Are you hooked? Is your mouth watering? Are you ready to start cheering the home team and gobble down hook, line and sinker everything that comes next?

Two new facts are presented from Spain, and they're the most negative you could find, without any kind of counterbalance reporting at all. Anything about the business reorganization plan presented today by Bankia? Anything at all? No, of course not, because the black hole, "scary story" that everyone who is still reading would no longer work. The truth kills the article, so the truth is left out.
The narrative hook is a literary device that has no place in serious, objective journalism in my opinion.

Good article though, when kept in perspective of course. smiley

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Enlightened self-interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened....
HighRev's Open House is my internet hangout. Drop by whenever you like. The door is always open. smiley
Highrev
Posts: 5025
Incept: 2009-02-21
Silver
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High quality global journalism requires investment. Please share this article with others using the link below, do not cut & paste the article. See our Ts&Cs and Copyright Policy for more detail. Email ftsales.support@ft.com to buy additional rights. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/5caddaa8-c50b-11....

An excerpt:
Quote:
Spanish unemployment falls in June
By Miles Johnson in Madrid

The number of Spaniards out of work fell in June ahead of the country’s tourist season as Madrid said it would announce further steps to meet its ambitious budget deficit reduction plans for this year.

The number of registered unemployed in Spain dropped by 98,853 month-on- month from May to June, data from the country’s labour ministry showed – the largest fall in June since the data series began in 1996.

The 2.1 per cent fall took Spanish joblessness down to 4.62m, with unemployment levels dropping across all of the country’s 17 autonomous regions in the third consecutive month of falling number of claimants.

Luis de Guindos, Spain’s finance minister, said that while the data should be viewed in a seasonal context, with industries such as tourism taking on employees for the summer period, the June drop in claimants was positive.

Engracia Hidalgo, secretary of state for employment, said: “June is traditionally a good month for jobs, but this has never reached a decrease of almost 100,000 people”.

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Enlightened self-interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened....
HighRev's Open House is my internet hangout. Drop by whenever you like. The door is always open. smiley
Obseedian
Posts: 11872
Incept: 2007-07-26
Silver
BBRY Central
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^^Probably related to Euro2012.

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Would you give your money to these banks? http://bankimplode.com/list/troubledbank....

“Those who vote decide nothing. Those who count the vote decide everything.” - Joseph Stalin
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/finan....
04 Jul 2012

Mr Rato, who quit as chairman of the bank in May just before it was bailed out to the tune of €23.5bn (£18.9bn), is named alongside 32 other Bankia managers in a lawsuit brought by UPyD, one of Spain’s smaller political parties.

Hours after the legal probe was announced, Bankia's chief executive Francisco Verdu, abruptly quit, announcing the move in a one sentence regulatory filing.

Spain’s top national court on accepted the suit, alleging fraud, price-fixing, embezzlement and falsifying accounts, though no date has yet been set for the hearings. ...
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
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Australia
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Quote:

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0704/fraud-c....
4 July 2012

Spaniards are angry with the political and business elites in general as the government of Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy has imposed austerity policies and had to seek European Union aid to save a series of banks including Bankia from collapse.

However, fury is particularly directed at Bankia as hundreds of thousands of small savers were persuaded to buy shares in the lender when it was floated on the stock market in 2011, only to see their investments all but wiped out in less than a year.


Quote:
Bankia's new management has requested a €19 billion bailout.

In the case brought by the Union, Progress and Democracy party, the High Court is demanding that Rato and the other executives appear in person.

It also wants former Bank of Spain governor Miguel Angel Fernandez Ordonez to appear as a witness, alongside the partner in auditor Deloitte who was in charge of signing off Bankia's results and the chairman of the Spanish stock market regulator...


Highrev
Posts: 5025
Incept: 2009-02-21
Silver
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That's right Lplate,

Stop the Looting, and Start the Prosecuting has started in Spain!
Quote:
Spain probes Bankia IPO; Rato named suspect
By Christopher Bjork and David Roman

MADRID (MarketWatch)—Spain’s national court Wednesday opened a criminal investigation into the stock market listing of Bankia SA, naming Rodrigo Rato and 32 other former board members as suspects in the case, court documents showed.

The probe was launched by an investigating judge following a complaint by a small Spanish political party, Union, Progreso y Democracia that accuses Bankia, its parent company and the board members of both companies of fraud, misappropriation of funds, and the falsification of the annual results for 2011 in relation with last year’s initial public offering of Bankia. http://www.marketwatch.com/story/spain-p....
I've chosen to post the MarketWatch story because it is the only one I've found that accurately presents the facts. For example, The Financial Times and the BBC say the court is "Spain's high court" and "the high court" respectively, as though it's the equivalent of the US Supreme Court. At least Reuters doesn't stick its foot in its mouth and limits what it says to "a Spanish court". The WSJ comes the closest with "a national court", which is what it is - it's the rough equivalent to a Federal District Court, which leaves us with the impression that this is an important proceeding, or the opposite of what a banana republic "supreme court" charade would make us think (wouldn't you say?).

The rest of Market Watch's story is accurate, and objective (leaving the "widespread public outrage" to the likes of the BBC).



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Enlightened self-interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened....
HighRev's Open House is my internet hangout. Drop by whenever you like. The door is always open. smiley

Genesis
Posts: 130804
Incept: 2007-06-26
Admin A True American Patriot!
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Hmmm... now THAT is a positive development.

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I don't care if it makes sense -- only if it makes money. -- Me
Bank (n): See scam, fraud and theft. Eat a bankster -- they're low-carb.
What part of "shall not be infringed" was unclear?
Highrev
Posts: 5025
Incept: 2009-02-21
Silver
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The CEO being forced to resign before the bailout announcement and subsequently the same with the entire board of directors were positive preludes as well. (I don't remember seeing much of that elsewhere either.)

And this from one of the "moral hazard" countries! smiley


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Enlightened self-interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened....
HighRev's Open House is my internet hangout. Drop by whenever you like. The door is always open. smiley
Henri
Posts: 191
Incept: 2007-09-23
Green
europe
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Oops -- 10YR over 7% again (open: 6.97%, current: 7.1%, +2.14%).

That save didn't last long.
Drench
Posts: 28631
Incept: 2009-11-10
Green
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Quote:
"The Eurogroup supports the recently adopted Commission recommendation to extend the deadline for the correction of the excessive deficit in Spain by one year to 2014," ministers said in a statement.

No final figure was agreed for aid to ailing Spanish lenders, weighed down by bad debts due to a housing crash and recession, but the EU has set a maximum of 100 billion euros ($123 billion) and some 30 billion euros would be available by the end of July if there was an urgent need.

A final loan agreement will be signed on or around July 20, Eurogroup chairman Jean-Claude Juncker told a news conference.

In one key decision closely watched by investors, ministers agreed that once a single European banking supervisor is set up next year, Spanish banks could be directly recapitalised from the euro zone rescue fund without requiring a state guarantee.
Quote:
But they made no apparent progress on activating the bloc's rescue funds to intervene in bond markets to bring down the spiralling borrowing costs of Spain and Italy, which threaten to drive them out of the market.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/48116689
Drench
Posts: 28631
Incept: 2009-11-10
Green
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Quote:
Spanish Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy announced tax increases and spending cuts totaling 65 billion euros ($80 billion), risking a deepening recession to keep the euro financial crisis at bay.

Rajoy’s fourth austerity package in seven months will raise the sales levy to 21 percent from 18 percent; scrap a tax rebate for home buyers; scale back unemployment benefits and study pension cuts; consolidate local governments and eliminate the year-end bonus for public workers. The budget measures, covering the next two-and-a-half years, are about double those previously announced.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-11....
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:
Spain Bank Subordinated Bondholders Trying to Sell in Illiquid Market
http://english.capital.gr/News.asp?id=15....
11 July 2012

Investors left holding positions in Spanish subordinated bonds were trying to sell them Wednesday after the Spanish government hinted these type of instruments might be forced to take losses.

Late Tuesday it emerged that investors holding any equity or hybrid capital instruments issued by Spanish banks that might need a euro-zone bailout could see their investments completely wiped out.

Conservative-type bondholders--like banks, funds and Asian investors--were left trying to exit their positions in weaker Spanish banks, but with few investors interested in buying they were finding it hard to sell, bond traders said.

The bond prices didn't collapse on the news, with these bonds having been dumped by investors for some time, as the precedent set by Irish banks in 2010 made investors more aware of the risk associated with subordinated debt.

However, "unlike in Ireland, the move to force losses on junior bondholders is a significantly more contentious issue in Spain where retail customers make up a large proportion of the investor base," said Daiwa Capital Markets credit analyst Michael Symonds.

Bondholders at Spain's larger banks--Banco Santander S.A. (SAN.MC), Banco Bilbao Vizcaya Argentaria S.A. (BBVA.MC) and CaixaBank S.A. (CABK.MC)--won't likely be affected by the change as they aren't likely to take part in the bailout. But smaller banks will be impacted, with trading on their bonds over the last months evidence of these concerns.

"Expect subordinated peripheral debt to trade lower as there had been some expectations that it would be treated with compassion because of the retail bias," said Investec fixed-income analysts Elisabeth Afseth and Brian Barry in a note.

Bankia's subordinated bonds in particular has been singled out, as it was the first bank to ask the Spanish government for aid, traders said....
Jubber
Posts: 14174
Incept: 2007-07-05
Gold
UK
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10y Spain 6.86% to 6.677%

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“The problem with socialism is that, sooner or later, you run out of other people’s money.” Thatcher
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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BBC tweet:

Quote:
Police fire rubber bullets at miners demonstrating against austerity cuts in Madrid, Spain

Mrbill
Posts: 7857
Incept: 2008-10-19
Gold
North Carolina
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Those miners kept my SO up all night during her visit there. Helicopters flying around starting at 1 AM for their protest.

She is "so over Madrid". Shouldn't a broke country be friendly to tourists? :)
Frat
Posts: 1935
Incept: 2009-07-15
Silver
NKY
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Naw, MrBill, they're "so over" tourists!

Telling a generational leech**** country that their days are over doesn't go over well. It's probably going to be even worse here - but I think it will be much more DE-centralized, simply because there are large groups of producers still out there. We're shrinking, to be sure, but we're there. Our riots are going to start in the ghettos as soon as the EBT cards don't get refilled - watch this to be the ultimate endgame. TPTB know this, so they'll keep their supporters fed as long as possible.


Interesting times folks.

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We're ****ed. Where's Henry Bowman when you need him?
Swingtrader
Posts: 9108
Incept: 2007-08-12
Green
United Oligarchic Goldman Sachs States of America
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Frat wrote..
as soon as the EBT cards don't get refilled - watch this to be the ultimate endgame. TPTB know this, so they'll keep their supporters fed as long as possible.
Which is why I think it more likely that the EBT/Snap cards, etc will get refilled/issued, but they just won't buy nearly as much because of higher prices. Then, Govt can say that they are issuing the cards, it's those evil speculators driving up prices.

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Swing said "Well, it is collapsing as we watch.This is what it looks like." Australian federal judge Jayne Jagot, doing what US judges need to do!
Lplate
Posts: 4737
Incept: 2008-08-06
Gold
Australia
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Quote:
Finland Asks Spain for Bank Shares to Guarantee Bailout
http://go.bloomberg.com/euro-crisis/2012....
July 12, 2012

There are few euro-zone countries with more solid accounts than Finland, which kept its deficit within the European Union’s 3 percent threshold even as its economy contracted 8.4 percent in 2009. Finland stuck by its agreements on the euro, unlike most other members of the currency, and can now name its price for bailing out Spanish banks: the Helsinki government would like shares in Spanish banks as a guarantee on funds it’s contributing toward their bailout, Kati Pohjanpalo reports...


Quote:
The option of taking shares as collateral on loans is being discussed with Spain, Finnish Finance Minister Jutta Urpilainen said on state-owned broadcaster YLE TV1 yesterday. The country’s share of Spain’s 100 billion-euro bank bailout is about 2 percent, and Finland is seeking collateral that will cover 40 percent of that – or about 800 million euros – based on the risk estimates of Standard & Poor’s, Urpilainen said.

Bajorgensen
Posts: 715
Incept: 2010-04-15
Green
Norway
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Hi all.

Just a short observation from Barcelona:

Spent the weekend in this beautiful city,
and it can be fully recommended for a visit!
Support the Spanish economy and stay a week, what a place!
Fantastic food, fabulous sites, incredible atmosphere, riviera like night life and a superb beach downtown.

You cannot feel the crisis at all, maybe because Catalonia is the richest part of Spain and the tourists are still pouring into Barcelona.
(the only negative for me was crowded beaches and some queuing)
My hosts are middle class, mid level managers, so they are doing quite well,
but they are working their asses off. 1000 of people ready to take their job and no pay raise for a while.
One comment really stuck when we were approached by a nice looking beggar.
"A new type of homeless..." Basically lots of people loosing their job+home and living on the streets.
Another thing is that lots of young people chose not to take any education as they got a job in construction during the bubble years.
"There is absolutely no future for them, even educated people cant get a job!"

They are catalan and one thing that struck me was how much they want independece!
Catalan people do not consider themselves Spanish and the support for full independence has risen the last years,
as they feel the rest of Spain is crawling on their back.
The feeling is that Catalonia would do great on their own.
This is even with greater autonomy over the last years.

I cant help wondering what would happen when things go south in Spain.
There is a strong wish for independence in Catalonia, Basque and Galicia.
All them have their own language, autonomy, elected representation (even president!) and do not feel spanish and are considered a different ethnicity.
(not to mention the canaries which is basically Africa)

The three regions would constitute roughly 1/4 of the people and more than 1/3 of the economy of Spain.
Keep and eye on this as things unravel, regardless of the bailout and austerity, Spain has a lot of pain ahead.
The property bubble is far from finished bursting...
Robw
Posts: 837
Incept: 2007-08-10
Silver
Southern California
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Quote:
the Helsinki government would like shares in Spanish banks as a guarantee on funds it’s contributing toward their bailout, Kati Pohjanpalo reports...


Shares in Spanish Banks? WTF good it that going to do? They should be forcing the banks to buy CDSs on their own debt and transfer ownership to Finland! And Finland was doing so well, until now.

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The laws of mathematics are not suggestions. - K.D.
Highrev
Posts: 5025
Incept: 2009-02-21
Silver
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In the Basque region alone, over half off their pension funding comes from Madrid. That's just a starter for you. Do a balance sheet analysis of those regions and you'll quickly understand why independence is only talked about. It's a non-starter until they're ready to take a 50% living standard haircut (except for Galicia).

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Enlightened self-interest http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlightened....
HighRev's Open House is my internet hangout. Drop by whenever you like. The door is always open. smiley
Bajorgensen
Posts: 715
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Norway
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According to Wikipedia, the Basque region has a GDP roughly 1/3 higher than Spains average.

http://www.eustat.es/elementos/ele000210....

The unemployment rate is roughly half...
I'd love to to an analysis, I think this might be something to keep an eye on for the next few years to come.
Where do I start? Where do you get your data from?
Do Madrid actually have the money? I think not!
When the hammer hits, it will become apparent to eveyone that the boomers will not get their pensions!
Obseedian
Posts: 11872
Incept: 2007-07-26
Silver
BBRY Central
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Quote:
In the Basque region alone, over half off their pension funding comes from Madrid.

But they no longer would have to pay taxes to Madrid either.

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Would you give your money to these banks? http://bankimplode.com/list/troubledbank....

“Those who vote decide nothing. Those who count the vote decide everything.” - Joseph Stalin
Robw
Posts: 837
Incept: 2007-08-10
Silver
Southern California
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That's what most people forget Obs. When it comes to debt, the middle finger can be very powerful. If only more people would use it, we could be well on our way to recovering from this mess.

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The laws of mathematics are not suggestions. - K.D.
Jeffrey_thomason
Posts: 7083
Incept: 2009-03-11
Green
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Not sure if I missed this being posted: http://www.eitb.com/en/news/politics/det....

Quote:

A video shows Ana Fabra, daughter of Castellon's regional council president Carlos Fabra, clapping and yelling "**** them all" as Mariano Rajoy announced cuts in unemployment benefits.



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"Until we look beyond the throne where the power structure lies, we'll fight amongst ourselves as freedom dies. The only hope for human kind lies in solidarity. The strength in our numbers sets us free."
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