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User Info Russian attack sub cruised Gulf waters undetected for weeks in forum [NotSoBreakingGeo]
Landshark
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Silent Running
Russian attack submarine sailed in Gulf of Mexico undetected for weeks, U.S. officials say

BY: Bill Gertz
August 14, 2012 5:00 am
http://freebeacon.com/silent-running/

A Russian nuclear-powered attack submarine armed with long-range cruise missiles operated undetected in the Gulf of Mexico for several weeks and its travel in strategic U.S. waters was only confirmed after it left the region, the Washington Free Beacon has learned.

It is only the second time since 2009 that a Russian attack submarine has patrolled so close to U.S. shores.

The stealth underwater incursion in the Gulf took place at the same time Russian strategic bombers made incursions into restricted U.S. airspace near Alaska and California in June and July, and highlights a growing military assertiveness by Moscow.

The submarine patrol also exposed what U.S. officials said were deficiencies in U.S. anti-submarine warfare capabilities—forces that are facing cuts under the Obama administration’s plan to reduce defense spending by $487 billion over the next 10 years.

The Navy is in charge of detecting submarines, especially those that sail near U.S. nuclear missile submarines, and uses undersea sensors and satellites to locate and track them.

The fact that the Akula was not detected in the Gulf is cause for concern, U.S. officials said.

The officials who are familiar with reports of the submarine patrol in the Gulf of Mexico said the vessel was a nuclear-powered Akula-class attack submarine, one of Russia’s quietest submarines.

A Navy spokeswoman declined to comment.

One official said the Akula operated without being detected for a month.

“The Akula was built for one reason and one reason only: To kill U.S. Navy ballistic missile submarines and their crews,” said a second U.S. official.

“It’s a very stealthy boat so it can sneak around and avoid detection and hope to get past any protective screen a boomer might have in place,” the official said, referring to the Navy nickname for strategic missile submarines.

The U.S. Navy operates a strategic nuclear submarine base at Kings Bay, Georgia. The base is homeport to eight missile-firing submarines, six of them equipped with nuclear-tipped missiles, and two armed with conventional warhead missiles.

“Sending a nuclear-propelled submarine into the Gulf of Mexico-Caribbean region is another manifestation of President Putin demonstrating that Russia is still a player on the world’s political-military stage,” said naval analyst and submarine warfare specialist Norman Polmar.

“Like the recent deployment of a task force led by a nuclear cruiser into the Caribbean, the Russian Navy provides him with a means of ‘showing the flag’ that is not possible with Russian air and ground forces,” Polmar said in an email.

The last time an Akula submarine was known to be close to U.S. shores was 2009, when two Akulas were spotted patrolling off the east coast of the United States.

Those submarine patrols raised concerns at the time about a new Russian military assertiveness toward the United States, according to the New York Times, which first reported the 2009 Akula submarine activity.

The latest submarine incursion in the Gulf further highlights the failure of the Obama administration’s “reset” policy of conciliatory actions designed to develop closer ties with Moscow.

Instead of closer ties, Russia under President Vladimir Putin, an ex-KGB intelligence officer who has said he wants to restore elements of Russia’s Soviet communist past, has adopted growing hardline policies against the United States.

Of the submarine activity, Sen. John Cornyn (R., Texas), member of the Senate Armed Services Committee, said, “It’s a confounding situation arising from a lack of leadership in our dealings with Moscow. While the president is touting our supposed ‘reset’ in relations with Russia, Vladimir Putin is actively working against American interests, whether it’s in Syria or here in our own backyard.”

The Navy is facing sharp cuts in forces needed to detect and counter such submarine activity.

The Obama administration’s defense budget proposal in February cut $1.3 billion from Navy shipbuilding projects, which will result in scrapping plans to build 16 new warships through 2017.

The budget also called for cutting plans to buy 10 advanced P-8 anti-submarine warfare jets needed for submarine detection.

In June, Russian strategic nuclear bombers and support aircraft conducted a large-scale nuclear bomber exercise in the arctic. The exercise included simulated strikes on “enemy” strategic sites that defense officials say likely included notional attacks on U.S. missile defenses in Alaska.

Under the terms of the 2010 New START arms accord, such exercises require 14-day advanced notice of strategic bomber drills, and notification after the drills end. No such notification was given.

A second, alarming air incursion took place July 4 on the West Coast when a Bear H strategic bomber flew into U.S. airspace near California and was met by U.S. interceptor jets.

That incursion was said to have been a bomber incursion that has not been seen since before the Soviet Union collapsed in 1991.

It could not be learned whether the submarine in the Gulf of Mexico was an Akula 1 type submarine or a more advanced Akula 2.

It is also not known why the submarine conducted the operation. Theories among U.S. analysts include the notion that submarine incursion was designed to further signal Russian displeasure at U.S. and NATO plans to deploy missile defenses in Europe.

Russia’s chief of the general staff, Gen. Nikolai Makarov, said in May that Russian forces would consider preemptive attacks on U.S. and allied missile defenses in Europe, and claimed the defenses are destabilizing in a crisis.

Makarov met with Army Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, in July. Dempsey questioned him about the Russian strategic bomber flights near U.S. territory.

The voyage of the submarine also could be part of Russian efforts to export the Akula.

Russia delivered one of its Akula-2 submarines to India in 2009. The submarine is distinctive for its large tail fin.

Brazil’s O Estado de Sao Paoli reported Aug. 2 that Russia plans to sell Venezuela up to 11 new submarines, including one Akula.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said Moscow’s military is working to set up naval replenishment facilities in Vietnam and Cuba, but denied there were plans to base naval forces in those states.

Asked if Russia planned a naval base in Cuba, Lavrov said July 28: “We are not speaking of any bases. The Russian navy ships serve exercise cruises and training in the same regions. To harbor, resupply, and enable the crew to rest are absolutely natural needs. We have spoken of such opportunities with our Cuban friends.” The comment was posted in the Russian Foreign Ministry website.

Russian warships and support vessels were sent to Venezuela in 2008 to take part in naval exercises in a show of Russian support for the leftist regime of Hugo Chavez. The ships also stopped in Cuba.

Russian Deputy Premier Dmitri Rogozin announced in February that Russia was working on a plan to build 10 new attack submarines and 10 new missile submarines through 2030, along with new aircraft carriers.

Submarine warfare specialists say the Akula remains the core of the Russian attack submarine force.

The submarines can fire both cruise missiles and torpedoes, and are equipped with the SSN-21 and SSN-27 submarine-launched cruise missiles, as well as SSN-15 anti-submarine-warfare missiles. The submarines also can lay mines.

The SSN-21 has a range of up to 1,860 miles.


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Kylafoon
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Thta's a big "Holy ****!!!"

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smiley smiley

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Makes one think...if they just now learned about this one...how many others are around, they don't know about yet?

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First the Chinese shoot a missile off the California coast, then they surface a sub in the middle of fleet maneuvers, and now the Russians have made fools of our detections system.

I remember this country used to be great.
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Did they see any oil down there?

Look, we do this kinda **** all over the world all the time, but we're not supposed to care about that. Instead we're expected to get all hot and bothered when we get a taste of what we dish out.

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Agau,

No you didnt!!!!! I thought we hashed that one out.. ;)

As to the Akula..that just sucks. I would have thought putting some sort of SOSUS like array down in the straights of Florida and a few other places would preclude that sort of thing. maybe we dont have any detectors down there? The Navy P3 fleet just isnt doing much ASW anymore either. At some point you need to keep a minimum presence for this sort of thing, even though the threat is "limited". To be truthful I dont think the Russian navy has that many sea worthy subs at the moment, but letting one into the backyard is just...sad.

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So much for our ability to maintain our perimeter..... then again, if we can't be bothered with illegal Mexicans....

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Mpilar
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Quote:
Look, we do this kinda **** all over the world all the time, but we're not supposed to care about that. Instead we're expected to get all hot and bothered when we get a taste of what we dish out.

Yup...we need to remember, we're not really the good guys anymore...although, by no stretch am I saying the Russians are...

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- Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin to slit throats. H. L. Mencken
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Yawn. This is what subs do. It's fairly common knowledge that they enter the straits of Juan de (MUCH closer than the gulf of M) and either lay in wait for Trident boomers to go past or lay listening devices to pick up the trail

Why aren't they picked up? Because detection is based on passive systems and a sub can be as quiet as background noise when needed. Active pinging is avoided because it's like a tracer round - it points out your own location first.

The US used to enter the black sea to put recording devices on a com line and return to change it often. Caught by espionage not detection.

They also mine harbors in north Korea with no detection

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The P3 Orion is wearing out. Brace yourself for the replacement

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Good point Gen.

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"...But whenever we see things done wildly, but taken tamely, then the State is growing insane..." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton 1910

"I found a flaw in the model that I perceived is the critical functioning structure that defines how the world works." - Alan Greenspan, October 2008
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think an EMP nuke cant happen in like 8 minutes? Hell we cant even out maneuver to avoid hitting a ****ing tanker.
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funny. you can bet we had/have a attack boat tail on every Russian boomer as well

that is how the game is played. its a big ocean (shrug)

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Maybe it was a birdy bread-bomber from the future?!
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1. I am surprised they didn't try sailing up the Mississippi River. :-)
2. I am NEVER going to give away the fact that I might have detected you if I'm not AT WAR with you. I might indeed let you surface a half mile off my CVN (might). Because I'm taking a big risk that your belligerent and kicking off a war without provocation.
3. I'm going ot wait until your propeller driven planes are yawning distance away from my F22 interceptors - because I'm not giving you any performance data on how fast I can get them in the air and firing missiles on you until I'm at war with you.
4. Never pass up an opportunity to score some increased budget.

Our armed forces may be at times incompetent (gulf incident), but universally so? Not buying it.
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heh that is what cracks me up about RIMPAC and the like

all those picture perfect camera shots from a sub with a beautifully lined up shot on an US CVN.

did the screen not see the sub - or did it ? who knows.

how many bullets u got left ? heh

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Maybe it was a birdy bread-bomber from the future?!
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"The submarine patrol also exposed what U.S. officials said were deficiencies in U.S. anti-submarine warfare capabilities—forces that are facing cuts under the Obama administration’s plan to reduce defense spending by $487 billion over the next 10 years."

The SOSUS net stretches from the Florida keys to Cancun. The Navy has their fleet sonar school in the keys for that reason. I find it hard to believe they missed a Russian sub coming through the straits of Florida, or the Yucatan pass undetected.
Second and more importantly why would we come out publicly and announce we can’t detect their subs in our own back yard, especially if it were true.

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Pathetic!

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Quote:
Second and more importantly why would we come out publicly and announce we can’t detect their subs in our own back yard, especially if it were true.
Because The "Defense" Budget Must Not Be Cut Ever.
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An Akula class!? Nope, not buying it.

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4. Never pass up an opportunity to score some increased budget.

Maybe I'm too cynical but it's the first thing that came to my mind. A nice story to plant before sequestration.
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Jata +1
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Just courious, if it was UNDETECED how in the world would anyone on this side of the fence finds out where it had been and for that duration? Have we receive some sort of email from the sub with navigational confirmation pictures and tell us "WE were THERE!"?

Another ploy to steer public sentiment for funding increase? Courious mind wants to know.

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There was a non fiction research based book Tom Clancy wrote (back when he did the writing) many years ago, published after Red October where he described the cat and mouse games.

He described one situation where a russian sub trailing a US sub for an extended period got a great photo op. The US sub surfaced and the crew got top side R&R, went swimming, etc.

The russian boat circled the other sub taking butt loads of photographs. Pants around the ankles.

CK is correct. Even once you know you're trailed you don't tip your hand. You can learn as much as they are learning about you.

If there's anything of strategic value up the Mississippi and the water is deep enough, they've been there.

The fact that the "undetected" sub is now known points straight to "Uncle Sugar can we have another $BB?"

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no mississippi this summer
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